lets hear some of them"
Does that mean they really want to hear this stuff? No of cousre not. I knew what we would find. I knew they just wanted more ammunition to ridicule. They proved to want just that.I have it to them anyway because I wanted ammunition of my own. I got it.
two incidents invovling my father.
(1) died and came back.
the real miracle was that an 89 year old man with very arrhythmical heart and lots of scar tissue came bounding back with strong rhythmical heart beat after being clinically dead for several minutes.
(2) readings changed before eyes of ER guys
they were at the house, they responded to call it seemed he having a heart attack or stroke. The readings of vital sings showed he his vitals were failing. We prayed for him and laid hands on him right then and there, and the came back to normal all signs of distress went away.
the ER guys were stunned. they were going "wow that's not supposed to happen." One was angry and shouting "this is didn't happen! It's impossible! there is no God this didn't' happen!"
Notice i said two incidence. this became important early on as one of the ridicule thugs says:
Originally Posted by drugstar
Yes. In one post he forgot the story and said he was there at the time, but forgot he said in other posts he wasn't.Notice he speaks one where I'm there and the other I'm not there, that's the way it is in the two stories but he can't follow the fact that it's two stories. So he remembered come muddled version that he can't keep track of, he's too stupid to observe that fact that there are two stories (see my post above) and just asserts that they are two versions of the same story. After some amount of counter mocking he says "there are two stories now!" As though there was a time when it was just one story, which is, of course, a lie. What else would I expect from such little brown shirt bullies?
But this was not my first clue (as though I needed a clue) that they were just looking for a ridicule gauntlet. The first response fomr the guy who started the thread was:
cool story man. did you see angles when you were dead or anything?
While I'm glad your father didn't die, it does seem as though you're setting the bar on miracles a little low here. If ything this sounds like a "miracle" of medicine to me. Maybe if he were dead for a week or something... That sounds more than a little fishy... kind of unrelated to the miracle claim but - really? I'm kinda skeptical that their first reaction was "there is no god"Suqraecirlce
I thought that it sounded a little embellished as the "medic in denial" had no relevance to communicating a story about a miraculous event and sounds too much like how Meta behaves, so it is likely just a projection of his behavior into the story for the effect of 'poisoning the well' against all that would doubt the story.
At this point Deist pops back in like a little child who is being ignored to say:
Originally Posted by Deist
Our old pal musffins (MFFJM2) tries to do a "rational" reconstruction of the facts.
Originally Posted by MFFJM2
they all said that. "we've heard this before" like that's supposed to disprove it. that's what you say because you can't admit the turth. what if you did accept the story as I said it. you have admit you are going to hell. that makes you uncomfortable, o you can't let yourself believe it can you?
Muffins; No, he didn't die.
His heart stopped for a few minutes, and that happens all the time. It is not to be equated with clinical death,
requires that all brain functions cease. Unless he was hooked up to an EEG, there would be no way of determining if this had happened. An EKG only monitors the heart functioning. It's still nice that he was returned to health, but this doesn't even qualify as unusual, let alone supernatural.
why is it hard to believe he would be hooked up to an EEG? They were in the ICU.
do you really think all the nurses in the ICR would be calling it a miracle if it was just his heart stopping? No they would not. they did. the first thing in the door they go "did you hear about the miracle?"
The GP said the heart stopping and coming back strong is the real miracle. the actual being dead and coming back is not that difficult that does happen. It's the coming back from the heart thing with a strong rhythmical beat at his age that is the Miracle.
I did say "clinically dead" the first 200 times I told it.
btw since you were not there you don't know if he took his brain waves or not. Since the surgeon who was there said he was dead I rather think they did so.
There are several natural explanations for this. The first is that this is after this therefore because of this reasoning.
The second is that the human mind has the ability to control many autonomous features including vital signs. You prayed over someone who thought that prayer would help, and then his own mind decided it did help and changed the vitals signs being registered. Yogis have been shown to be able to control these same vital signs, but perhaps you think they do it through prayer as well.
My account of the story:the ER guys were stunned. they were going "wow that's not supposed to happen." One was angry and shouting "this is didn't happen! It's impossible! there is no God this didn't' happen!"
MUffins: Of course they did, because that makes the story so much better, and so appropriate to this website.